Eleanor Finch
In the role-playing game Pathfinder, players can choose to use either Will Saves or Diplomacy to advance their objectives. Will Saves are a type of skill check that helps players resist mental effects, such as mind control, while Diplomacy is a skill that allows players to gather information, change attitudes, and negotiate with non-player characters. Both skills have their advantages and disadvantages. Diplomacy, for example, can help players gain information and influence others, but it may not always be effective, especially if the request goes against the nature of the target. On the other hand, Will Saves can be essential for resisting mind-altering spells and effects, but they may not help with gathering information or changing attitudes. Ultimately, the choice between Will Saves and Diplomacy depends on the specific situation and the player's objectives.
Characteristics of Will Saves and Diplomacy in Pathfinder
| Characteristics | Values |
|---|---|
| Will Saves | A spell that can be used to make a high-level magus fail a will save |
| Diplomacy | A skill that can be used to gather information about a specific topic or individual |
| Will Saves | Can be used in conjunction with other spells or abilities to increase their effectiveness |
| Diplomacy | Can be used to improve relationships with NPCs and gain information |
| Will Saves | May have a higher chance of success depending on the situation |
| Diplomacy | May take longer and require concessions, but is less likely to have negative consequences |
| Will Saves | Can be used to protect against mind control or influence attempts |
| Diplomacy | Is not mind control, but can be used to influence others within reason |
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What You'll Learn
Diplomacy is a valuable mechanic to handle NPC interaction
While diplomacy may take longer and require concessions, it is less likely to lead to negative consequences down the line. On the other hand, intimidation can be quicker and easier, especially for certain character types, but it can leave a mess and have unintended fallout. For instance, a player who intimidates an NPC into letting them into a restricted area may find that the NPC later seeks revenge or reports them to the authorities.
Diplomacy also allows players to gather information about specific topics or individuals. By spending time interacting with NPCs in taverns, markets, and other gathering places, players can gain valuable knowledge and potentially influence the NPCs' attitudes towards them. This can be especially useful in preparation for important events, such as elections, where diplomacy may help sway votes in the player's favour.
However, it's important to note that diplomacy has its limitations. It cannot be used to completely control NPCs' actions, and it is subject to the NPCs' underlying nature and culture. Additionally, the effects of diplomacy manipulation may only last for a limited time, after which the NPCs' attitudes may return to their normal state.
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Intimidation is quicker but can have repercussions
Intimidation is a quicker way to get what you want in Pathfinder, but it can have repercussions. While it may be easier for a character to intimidate an NPC into letting them into a restricted area, there is a chance that the NPC will report them to the authorities. Even if the intimidation is successful, the NPC's attitude towards the player will change, and they may be less willing to help in the future.
In contrast, Diplomacy allows the NPC to choose how they comply and on better terms. It takes longer and may require concessions, but it is less likely to have negative consequences in the long run. A successful diplomacy check can improve an NPC's attitude towards the player, making them more helpful and potentially opening up new opportunities for interaction.
The choice between intimidation and diplomacy depends on the player's goals and the situation at hand. Intimidation may be useful in situations where strength is respected more than words, while diplomacy is better suited for building long-term relationships and negotiating favourable terms.
It's worth noting that the repercussions of intimidation can be significant, as failing an intimidation check could result in the player being chased by guards or facing other negative consequences. On the other hand, diplomacy is not mind control, and there are limits to what can be achieved through negotiation alone.
Ultimately, both skills have their advantages and disadvantages, and a good player will know when to use each one effectively to achieve their goals in the game.
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Diplomacy can be used to gather information
Diplomacy is a valuable skill in Pathfinder, especially when interacting with NPCs. It can be used to gather information about a specific topic or individual. To do this, players must spend at least 1d4 hours talking to people in places like local taverns, markets, and other gathering spots. The difficulty of this task depends on the obscurity of the information sought. For common knowledge or rumours, the DC (Difficulty Class) is typically 10, while for secret or obscure knowledge, the DC may be 20 or higher. Players can also retry Diplomacy checks when gathering information.
Diplomacy can be a useful tool for negotiation and getting what you want. It allows the target to choose how they comply and on better terms, which can lead to fewer negative consequences in the long run compared to other skills like Intimidation. For example, a successful Diplomacy check might involve a character talking their way into a restricted area, with the guard allowing them to enter later when it's less risky. However, it's important to note that Diplomacy is not mind control, and there are limits to what it can achieve. It may not work on individuals with deep ties to someone else, and the effects of Diplomacy manipulation typically only last up to 4 hours.
Additionally, Diplomacy can be used in bargaining situations, such as when buying or selling items. By using the rules for bargaining, players can attempt to get a better price, but they also give up some control over their character's decisions and accept the risk of the deal falling through. Diplomacy checks can also be used to influence people's attitudes towards the player character, improving their relationship and making them more favourable.
In comparison, Will Saves are a different mechanic in Pathfinder, representing a character's ability to resist mental effects, such as spells or magical abilities that influence the mind. While both Diplomacy and Will Saves are important in the game, they serve different purposes. Diplomacy is primarily used for interaction and information gathering, while Will Saves are used to defend against mental attacks or influences.
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Will saves can be made more difficult with spells
Diplomacy and Will saves are both important aspects of Pathfinder, a role-playing game. While diplomacy is a valuable skill for interacting with NPCs and gathering information, Will saves are essential for resisting certain spells and effects that target the character's mind or willpower.
When it comes to Will saves, certain spells and abilities can make it more challenging for a character to succeed. Here are some ways in which Will saves can be made more difficult:
Spells and Magical Effects:
- Mind-affecting Spells: Various spells in Pathfinder can influence or control the minds of targets, making it harder for them to succeed on Will saves. Examples include enchantment spells like "Charm Person" or "Dominate Person," which can impair a character's judgment or force them to obey commands.
- Divination Spells: Spells like "Commune" or "Divination" can be used to gather information or predict a character's actions, potentially setting them up for a more challenging Will save.
- Negative Levels: Inflicting negative levels on a target can impose penalties on their Will saves. Each negative level typically results in a –1 penalty to saving throws, making it harder for the character to resist certain effects.
- Ability Damage or Drain: Reducing a character's Wisdom or Charisma scores through ability damage or drain can lower their bonus to Will saves, making it more difficult for them to succeed.
- Cursed Items: Certain cursed items or artifacts can impose penalties on Will saves. For example, a cursed ioun stone might cause negative effects that hinder a character's ability to make successful Will saves.
It is important to note that the effectiveness of these methods may vary depending on the specific rules and editions of Pathfinder being played, as well as the character's attributes and abilities. Additionally, a skilled player or Game Master (GM) can incorporate creative role-playing elements to make Will saves more engaging and challenging.
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Diplomacy is not mind control
Diplomacy is supposed to represent negotiation using suitable etiquette and manners. It takes longer and may require concessions, but it is less likely to have negative repercussions in the long run. For instance, a player may use diplomacy to charm a guard into letting them into a restricted area. The guard may say it's not a good time and ask the player to come back later, thus avoiding any potential trouble for the guard. On the other hand, intimidation may get the player into the restricted area immediately, but it could also result in the guard calling for backup or holding a grudge.
The effects of diplomacy manipulation only last up to 4 hours. After that, the target's opinion of the player returns to normal, which is usually indifferent. Additionally, diplomacy is limited in the number of people it can influence. It is also not effective on those who are already hostile towards the player. In these cases, intimidation may be a more successful approach.
Diplomacy can be useful in certain situations, such as winning an election or bargaining for a better price. However, it is not a catch-all solution, and players should be aware of its limitations. A good GM will set clear expectations for what can be achieved with a successful diplomacy check. Ultimately, while diplomacy is a valuable skill in Pathfinder, it is not mind control, and players should not treat it as such.
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Frequently asked questions
Intimidation is generally quicker and easier, but it can have negative consequences. Diplomacy takes longer and may involve concessions, but it is less likely to cause problems in the long run.
No, Diplomacy is not mind control. You can use it for gathering information and influencing a limited number of people, but only if they are already friendly towards you.
If Intimidation fails, there may be serious repercussions, such as having city guards chase after you. It can also ruin relationships with friends and cause NPCs to hold a grudge.
Yes, Diplomacy can be used for bargaining and gathering information about a specific topic or individual.
You can use spells like Mind Fog or a Witch's Evil Eye Hex to reduce their Will save. Alternatively, you can hire or produce an army of minions to overwhelm them with scroll usage.
